353 | Success and Generational Wealth with Mark White

Sep 18

[00:00:00]
Mark White: , young, dumb and hungry is what I was. Didn't realize the magnitude of potential failure or potential loss.
A lot of people just think as long as, as long as you go do the work, everything's going to be fine. And I know people that work their tail off that still broke every Friday. Right. You know, , it's understanding the full picture.
what's so funny is how you're in business. Nobody knows who you are, but when you're successful, everybody goes, well, I wish I could just flip a switch and be successful like that. Like he did. Y'all didn't see me for the last eight years, did you,
[00:01:00]
Chaz Wolfe: What's up everybody. I'm Chas Wolf gathering the Kings podcast. I'm coming back to you here with another King on the stage today. Mark White, my brother, Mark, how we doing? Doing great. How are you? I'm wonderful. It's it's freaking Monday. Is
Mark White: that how you feel about Mondays too? You know,~ uh,~ it's it's just the start of another chaotic week looking for another Friday every Monday, but there you go,
Chaz Wolfe: right?
Another chance to
Mark White: here's a lot better weather than we had last
Chaz Wolfe: week. Oh yeah. You know, honestly,~ um,~ you know, for the, for the people that are listening, [00:02:00] not viewing,~ um,~ first off, if you are listening, cool, but you should check us out on YouTube so you can see Mark's background, but Mark's got some beautiful white tail in his background.
And that's what I was thinking about this morning. Cause it's been like a hundred degrees here in Kansas city, literally walk out this morning and it was cool. And I was thinking about white tail. So,~ um,~ it was a good morning, Mark. Absolutely. Yeah, well,~ uh,~ tell us what kind of business that you got here.
You've got,~ uh,~ you've got quite a bit going on in your world. I, you said, chaotic, chaotic mess, but tell us what kind of business or businesses that you've got going on over there and we'll get rolling.
Mark White: So my main, my main source of income is,~ um, uh, ~I'm partners in a commercial construction company, so we,~ uh,~ we were based out of West Tennessee and, my partner, I purchased this company in 2010,~ uh,~ against all odds and against all recommendations by friends and family.
Everybody thought we were crazy. ~Um, ~and if I had it to do over and know what I know now, I probably wouldn't [00:03:00] recommend myself to do that. So,~ uh,~ so we, we purchased this company in 2010. ~Uh, ~we were college roommates, best friends. ~Uh, ~we were both in the landscaping industry prior to that and,~ uh,~ had no experience in commercial construction.
And,~ uh,~ so that business has been flourishing ever since. So,~ uh,~ throughout the process, we've made relationships with other people. And now we're part, we're part owners in a commercial development company that we're the sole contractor for. Sure. And, ~um. ~And then my wife and I along the way have kind of bought rental properties and have a short term rental with a condo at the beach.
And, and, and then I've got my hands in a few other businesses,~ uh,~ that some of them I'm trying to keep under my hat because it's a, can be a conflict with other contractors. Cause we do subcontracting work in some, some instances, [00:04:00] but,~ uh,~ you know, just make calculated risk and go for it. You know, that's kind of been my
Chaz Wolfe: motto.
I love it. I love the,~ uh,~ the diversity, but also how you said that, you know, you've got one main focus and you have had for a while now. And obviously, over the course of time relationships. I also love that piece that you said relationships of what have stemmed some of the other opportunities. ~Um, ~I want to get into a little bit of, You, your story, but you've said several things that are super interesting already, especially the,~ uh,~ that you wouldn't, you wouldn't recommend it to yourself again.
I think it's funny because as entrepreneurs, if we knew what we knew ahead of time, oftentimes we never take the risk it it's, it's too much for our brain to fathom, you know, until we actually get in it and then you can't go anywhere. And so figure it like forces you to figure it out. Is that in essence, kind of how you feel about it as well?
Mark White: Oh, absolutely. I mean, young, dumb and hungry is what I was. You know, and, and, you know, didn't realize [00:05:00] the magnitude of potential failure or potential loss. And so all I knew was,~ uh,~ work hard and it's going to work out and, and,~ uh,~ Yeah. I mean, now anything I get into, I'm a lot more calculated, a little more conservative, but yeah, my father and I, we had successful landscaping businesses, but we wasn't real cash heavy.
So when we bought this company, you know, we barely had enough cash to put in to the company to, to make payroll. And we were having a hustle with our, our existing business. So we kept our landscaping companies. And I kind of ran that side of it and my partner kind of helped head up the new construction and we kept on one of the, one of the owners of the company to assist us the first couple of years.
Sure. And,~ uh,~ you know, I remember many Thursdays, Randall giving me a call like, Hey man, can you go [00:06:00] collect some money from some customers? We got payroll to make tomorrow. You know, and I was literally, you know, running these really fast paced,~ uh,~ landscape jobs just to try to pump as much money out of those because in construction, it, you're on, you do 30 days worth of work and then you're on 30 day terms and, and sometimes even longer than that.
So you may have to float a job for 60, 90 days before you see a penny of it. Right. Yeah. Our accountant told us we needed 200, 000 in our account. We looked at him and was like, what? And now, that's a fraction of what we keep in our account
Chaz Wolfe: now. Yeah. Yeah, I think that there's a lot of,~ um,~ a lot of wisdom here.
~Uh, ~not only just the prudency of building something so that way when things do go wrong, inevitably they will, that you have a reserve. ~Um, ~let's talk for just a quick second. ~Uh, ~I'm going to come back to you and your deep seated. Why I always ask that first, but I'm going to, I'm going to pause here. Cause I think we're on some really great stuff, you know, like [00:07:00] in the midst of that, you being scrappy basically, right?
Like I don't have the 200, 000 that my CPA suggested. ~Um, ~what I did have was some energy and some hunger and some figured it out. And this, you know, whatever word that is, help us understand how you made it through because. What you're saying practically that you don't make those types of decisions anymore, because you know, things are going to come up.
How does the guy listening right now? Who's in that sticky get out or get
Mark White: through, man, you just got to be hungry, you know, and, and aggressive and. And I see so many business people that want to be successful, but, you know, they want to also go home at 3. 30 in the afternoon or four o'clock,~ uh,~ when I was young, and I probably sacrificed family time a little bit more than I'm proud to say, but,~ uh,~ you know, I put the extra effort in, you know, I would, I would go home, do the family thing, get the kids in the [00:08:00] bed, And then work on estimates at night, work on billing, whatever I had to do to make it happen.
And so,~ um,~ you just have to do whatever it takes. And, you know, now I'm at a point that I have all the proper managers and the proper people in place. If I want to just walk out of this office right now, the wheels aren't going to come off. But as long as you are the one that's greasing the wheels and you got to keep the wheels on, you just got to make sure stuff gets done.
So for that young business person, just do whatever it takes. And you may not get to have the weekend off. You may have to work this weekend. But I did that. I was very fortunate. I did that one,~ uh,~ early when I was early in my marriage and my kids, my kids were very, very young and it wasn't a big deal. Now I coach all their ball teams, you know, I'm involved in everything, but it took me 10 or 12 years to get to that point.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, I think that's a good timeline, you know, as far as, [00:09:00] well, first off the, the reality of doing whatever it takes that that's a little subjective. So I want to dive into that a little bit, but doing whatever it takes. Consistently for a long enough period of time to where then there are systems, people, regular, a machine that's working.
And not just you is what I'm hearing. You say, as far as whatever it takes to find that for me a little bit, because man, I've heard it there. I've read it in books. I've read it in audio or listening to audio books, podcasts, like you saying, I got to do whatever it takes. I used to wear a wristband that says I'm committed, whatever it takes.
What does that mean to, to Mark White?
Mark White: Oh, you know, growing up like I did on a farm,~ uh,~ you may have to be the CEO, the secretary, the accountant. You may have to go change the transmission in a truck because you're trying to save a little money. ~Uh, ~so, at the end of the day, whatever it takes is [00:10:00] just exactly what it is, whatever it takes.
And,~ uh,~ I guess, I guess the easy part for me, that's the hard part for a lot of people, is I understood finance. And so... A lot of people just think as long as, as long as you go do the work, everything's going to be fine. And I know people that work their tail off that still broke every Friday. It's understanding the full picture.
Yeah. So to managing the money, the whole process. So early in the career, whatever it takes was just wearing every hat of the company. Yeah, whatever happened and, but don't be afraid to delegate those things. That's very easily delegatable. Yeah. That's the word. I don't know, but you know, I mean, I see so many guys that will step in front of their employees and do the grunt work because they wasn't doing it.
Right. Right. Take five minutes and show them how to do it. Right. And then you move on to the next task or, [00:11:00] or you move on to preparing the next job.
And so many people say, well, I'm not as efficient. Well, sometimes growth of a company has so many levels of inefficiencies. Nobody's ever going to do it as good as you will. So when you hire those people and you've got them, sometimes it may take two or three people to do the volume of work that you could do by yourself.
But you're never gonna, you're never gonna grow if you don't go through that process. And so. You know, I, I tell people all the time, like when I was landscaping, sometimes it took, you know, me and one guy could go out and do a job and make a good living, but it took me having four employees before I ever got to the point where I could step back and go, you know, give direction and still make the same money.
And then once I got above that, then it was. More than what I can do on my own.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, it's so [00:12:00] true. You're really talking about a very key break point. I want to, I want to dive more into that. You said something a second ago that I want to hit first, and that was that you grew up on a farm. And I think that anybody that grew up on a farm or grew up in a small town, even realizes what you just said, which was, you know, I, you, you see, like, I I've seen my grandfather and even, even my dad, who's not necessarily a farmer, but small town, veterinarian,~ uh,~ multiple clinics.
He's got a herd of cattle and some farm ground and stuff, but I see him do all the things, all the hats,~ um,~ because it's whatever it takes. Like that's that way of life. And so I, I, I recognize that. And I think that the listeners can as well. So my question is, but then quickly you were like, but you gotta delegate
And so you gotta be willing to do it all, but then you gotta be willing to give it away. And so tell us about that transition real quick here, and I'll, and I'll lead it right into that, that break point that you're talking about having, having more employees to be able to really grow. What's that break point of taking it all, doing whatever it [00:13:00] takes, but then also being able to delegate it out?
~Uh, ~
Mark White: I think it's, I can't think it's the point when you start to gain more work than you can handle. ~Uh, ~so when I was earning my career, you know, I'm scrambling to get every job I can and, and to pay the bills. But once I got to the point where I had more work than I can do myself, that come to the point, I hired somebody and then I hired somebody else.
And, you know, it was just a slow process and it was tough. And luckily along the way, I've had some key people in my life that. I was able to delegate,~ um,~ not everybody's still with me today, but they were, and a lot of people are still, I have a good relationship with and good friends with, but I had really good key people throughout my career.
Help me with that growth and be able to hand that off, you know, and obviously different levels of different types, you know, it was the guy that could run the skid steer on the job site. So I could be answering the phone and not, you know, stopping the skid steer every [00:14:00] five minutes to answer the phone. So to the point of having an office manager and.
Just, I mean, every, it's just a little, little growth. And what's so funny is how you're in business. Nobody knows who you are, but when you're successful, everybody goes, well, I wish I could just flip a switch and be successful like that. Like he did. Y'all didn't see me for the last eight years, did you, you know, but that's, that's,~ uh,~ just being able to hand that off as,~ uh,~ it's tough.
It's probably one of the, other than firing employees, it's probably the toughest, toughest thing in my career is delegating and giving that
Chaz Wolfe: away to your points. The only way to grow going back to your other point a few minutes ago about, okay, so. You know, you could do the same work as maybe two or three people.
And it even took maybe three or four people really to like, get you fully to the next level. I find a lot of entrepreneurs get stuck right there because two things, one, [00:15:00] they just can't wrap their mind around why these three or four people aren't as productive or maybe as good as they are. Like they, it's hard for them to, to process in their brain.
Why do I need four people? When, if I got rid of all of them, I could pretty much do all of this by myself. Not calculating all of the hats and the, whatever it takes and the weekends. And they're not, they're, they're, they're small minded in that way. So it's tough to go to that next level and go, well, if I shoot, if I brought on five and six, then I could really go to the next level.
It's tough to get to that place, but then also just from a funding perspective, like you're in growth mode and I'm paying three
Mark White: guys to do the job that I was doing
Chaz Wolfe: by myself. And so from like a finance perspective, I'm thinking, well, geez, and you want me to hire three more, give us a little bit of navigation through that timeframe for you.
Mark White: Yeah. So that growth, that growth phase, honestly, is honestly the toughest because there's a hard decision. Do I just scale back and just do it myself and still make the same money? And,~ uh,~ but I, [00:16:00] my situation was always wanted more. So I was never satisfied. And then my wife's asked me many, many times, when are you ever going to be satisfied?
I'm like, why,~ uh,~ it's, it's, to me, it's about the, the thrill of the hunt, the, you know, what I can achieve. It's not about the money. I mean, the money is a by product of what I did. And,~ uh,~ it's a nice byproduct, but a lot of times it's more about,~ uh,~ satisfying customers and doing what I tell people I'm going to do,~ uh,~ it's, and, and then in the, in the, in the return, it's,~ uh,~ it's been good financially.
But that growth phase, and I know a lot of people that couldn't get through that. They tried it. They hire a couple people and then they get frustrated with them and just say the heck with it and go back to, you know, running everything theirself and scaling down. ~Um, ~and I was probably at that point whenever I bought the construction company.
So I was kind of forced into that next level. I had [00:17:00] probably four employees. I was able to go work on the job till noon. And then I'd say, Hey guys, y'all get to this point by the end of the day. And I'd go be at jobs, do that. And then when I bought the construction company, it forced me to instantly double in size with employees and volume.
And
Chaz Wolfe: you think it forced you to think differently.
Mark White: So, and I had a part and then we gained a partner and we felt like we had to, you know, at least do twice as much, you know?
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah. Yeah. I think that,~ uh,~ you're spot on. You said a few minutes ago that, that you're, you weren't done. I'm not done. I'd be satisfied.
I'm not done. And so we have this phrase inside of gathering the Kings,~ uh,~ peer to peer mastermind that,~ uh,~ we're grateful, but not done. And there is a unique perspective to be able to slow down enough to be grateful, be able to take, you know, a smell of the roses, if you will, at the current stage that you're at.
But then also recognize fully that zero chance. I'm stopping here. What are your thoughts on, you [00:18:00] know, your, your successful trajectory in multiple industries now and,~ uh,~ a very large commercial construction company. Now it's like, surely there's been times along the way where even though that driving force on the inside of you, that maybe your wife was like, Oh yeah, he's at it again.
Cause my wife said the same thing, but. There was maybe a quiet moment where you were grateful, like, Oh man, I like looking back, but then in that same thought going, but I can't stop here. Do you have one of those moments?
Mark White: Yeah. I mean, I had a business consultant in here not long ago, just looking over some things.
And he said, I'm scared to walk out of your office. I'm afraid you might start another business if I'm not looking,
because. One of the things in this line of work, and once you are successful and people notice that, I feel like I'm drowning in opportunities from time to time, because people throw stuff at you left and right. And so you have to be very calculated. ~Uh, ~so, I mean, I'm very fortunate, [00:19:00] fortunate to that, but you know, I, everything I do is an extension of, of, of the company that I have.
So if I'm, if I'm diving off into another business, it's because. One of my, one of my current businesses is an asset to that and can make it an easier way to be successful. You know, I'm working with some guys right now. We're, we're, we're partners in a company and we're fixing to start building storage facilities, storage units.
I'm a general contractor. I have my own concrete crew. ~Uh, ~we, we're, so as a general contractor, we're, we're a large contractor, but we also self perform concrete and masonry and some other traits, well, guess what's in storage units, a lot of concrete,
Chaz Wolfe: a lot of concrete. I kind of get to have my
Mark White: cake and eat it too,~ uh,~ keeping our costs at a minimum and, and, and being, being able to supply one business with another,~ uh,~ a bit of revenue.
So, you know, [00:20:00] and even in the rental business, I, you know, I get to use some of my construction employees on their off time to go work on some of my rental properties. Yeah. So everything I do is calculated and, and it's an extension of what I already have. So I'm not. Diving off and buying some crazy business that, you know, that's often left field in another state, you know, but, but everything is an extension of what I've already, already do.
Chaz Wolfe: What's some of the calculation that you've taken around some, some of those businesses that you have that are,~ uh,~ you know, secondary or even tertiary to what you currently do main mainstream. Like when you're thinking about starting this next one and it has a, it has a connection point, like you're just describing is that.
You know, is there, is there a calculation of, of,~ uh,~ does this industry work or, or how much does it affect or how much does it take me away from my current business? Or even going back a little bit, when you started the very first offshoot, was the current business at a certain revenue point? Did you have some sort of a like guideline [00:21:00] around?
I don't want to be distracted and have something else going on, or are you just kind of went for it? Like, give us a little bit of that.
Mark White: Well, just kind of what you said about what is it going to take away from this business? So as long as it's not going to take away. If I buy a rental property, you know, it's calculated that When I bought my first one, I mean, it literally paid for itself.
And then I bought my second one, bought my third one, they're all, they were all paying for themselves. And, you know, I know you hear Dave Ramsey say, well, you know, your rental property's never really paid for itself. Well, if you manage them right, they do. ~Uh, ~and the key is not take too much out of my pocket to be able to grow those.
Yeah. And then later down the road, when I would buy a rental property, it might not be as good a deal, but I had five other rental properties that were cashflow right. So now, you know, I probably bring in 150, 000 a year and long term and short term rental. And,~ uh,~ and I've done that with very [00:22:00] little out of pocket cash, just because,~ um,~ I took that calculated risk.
~Um, ~you know, my partner and I funded a new business venture not long ago. I'm not going to say too much about it because I want to keep it on the down low a little bit, but we had the right person to manage that company and he had the knowledge and the contacts in the industry. And we. We've had to provide a little capital, but it's killing it.
You know, you just gotta know your market. You gotta know what's available. I mean, you don't go, you don't go open up a shoe shining shop and everybody's wearing sandals, you know? Right. You just gotta know what the market, what's available,~ um,~ and know you're not getting into something with low profit margins or, or high input costs.
So yeah. What I'm really looking for is low input costs with high profit margins, which I mean, There's
Chaz Wolfe: not, I guess, but yeah, but to your point that you're, you're,~ uh,~ you're more fierce about [00:23:00] calculating what that looks like and whether it's worth, you know, worth a little bit or a lot of bit of your time or money.
Mark White: Yeah, you just got to figure out if it's worth the time and, and now I have less time and more money. You still had more time and less money, right? So I can put the time into the early investments. And now I can put more money in. I'm looking for more investments that take more money and less time.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Yeah. It's funny how you say that, that the opportunities,~ uh,~ sometimes you drown in them, the more successful you become. I had two or three people in a Facebook or Instagram,~ uh,~ DM pitched me an opportunity to just this weekend and people that I currently know, they're not just like random,~ uh,~ you know, spammers, but people that I actually know, they reached out, Hey, I'd love to get your opinion on this.
I'd love for you to do that, that, that, that, that. And both of them, I'm like, Hey,~ um,~ I good for you excited for you, but I can't be part of that. And it wasn't because I didn't in, wasn't excited about their business or I just, no, I'm, I got these things going on over here and that is not in the lane that I'm going.
And so best of [00:24:00] luck to you. And so it sounds hard or feels hard to say no. Now, especially when you're younger, saying whatever it takes is kind of saying yes to everything. Right.
Mark White: Well, I mean, I had somebody pitched me something a while back. There was a. Easily could have been a successful business, but it was a high input cost and a high,~ uh,~ input cost of time.
And, you know, and I was like, look, this, it was going to be a longterm play. It was probably going to take several years to become profitable. Like at my, at my point in my career, I'm looking for a residual cashflow. I'm looking for somewhere I can put my money, invest in something that's going to give me a return and not take forever, or at least not cost me anything, if it's going to take forever, it needs to pay for itself along the way.
Yeah, you know, so it's just, you know, you know, for the early business guy, go beat the bushes and work, work, get it out of work and make [00:25:00] the time. But then once you get the money, you gotta kind of be a good steward of that money and, and,~ uh,~ and put it in the right places to, and what I'm trying to do is create, you know, generational wealth.
That's where I'm at. You know, I've, I've, I've made it. I could retire tomorrow. ~Uh, ~if I wanted to,~ uh,~ I mean, I wouldn't be a wealthy retired person. I would be, I would be able to survive. And, but now I'm at a point, I need to figure out a way to get to that next level of generational wealth. Yeah.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, it's an exciting thing, actually.
I talk about it quite a bit. ~Um, ~you know, I, I find myself in a, I've actually, I find myself a lot of people that like to talk about it, but not actually a lot of people are, are building the, the framework to actually have generational wealth, which is. You know, obviously multiple assets, but then there's ways to protect it.
And, you know, there's a lot of money in attorneys and CPAs. I have to go into that. I actually had a guy on the show probably over a year ago. And,~ um,~ he said he, not only does he know the number, but he's, [00:26:00] he's built the entire plan, CPAs, attorneys, everything,~ uh,~ for four generations. And,~ uh,~ he's got it all like, it's, it's like, it's like a blueprint.
Just follow this. For generations and we're wealthy not we are wealthy, but it will the wealth will stay is probably a better way to say it And so why do you find yourself interested in generational wealth? Why why is that a thing as opposed to giving it away or Whatever else we can do with with money.
Why is it important for you that the white family for generations? Continues,
Mark White: I don't know. I just I want to leave my kids something, you know, I want I'm like most families in this situation I don't want to put it on a platter, but,~ uh,~ but I, I want to give them an opportunity, you know, like, you know, like my, my dad, for instance, he's a farmer and I could still be there working on the farm.
Probably living fairly modestly,~ uh,~ but, you know, over the last few years, I started buying [00:27:00] farmland,~ uh,~ around my dad. So, hey, if one of my kids want to farm one day, they're not going to have to sacrifice until their nearly retirement age to get, get that ability, you know,~ uh,~ so, you know, it's, it's, it's a double edged sword.
Cause success can taint your children if you're not careful. And I, I, I try to make sure I'm trying to get them the work ethic and. The understanding of how hard money was to come by, you know, they think everywhere they go, they can just, you know, Hey, I want that. And, you know, and we have to explain to them all the time.
Not everybody can go on five vacations a year. And not everybody can do this and do that. And you're not going to be able to, when you get a job, unless you work hard and sacrifice.
[00:28:00]
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah. It's an interesting,~ uh,~ mantle to pass, right? Because. In essence, I mean, I've had this conversation with so many entrepreneurs, even including my dad,~ uh,~ kind of a quick backstory on that is I didn't meet my dad till I was 24.
He didn't know I existed. I thought somebody else was my dad. And so small town, like the guy I just explained, but small, [00:29:00] you know, a veterinary practice cattle, my grandfather, his father is a farmer and hat was for many years. So I understand that, that perspective that you're coming from. And it's like, you have this,~ um,~ You know, innate value in work ethic and, and doing whatever it takes, all the things that we've just been discussing.
And we want to pass that along to the kids, right? But at the same time, you are producing already a completely different life. Your kids are growing up way different than you did simply by the success that you've already had. And so it's like, how do I balance this? How do I balance the,~ uh,~ experience that they have in life?
They're not going to go through the same things that I did or that you did. ~Um, ~but I still want to be able to help them think through situations like that. What would you say to that? How do you help, how do you help the kids think through situations? Yeah,
Mark White: I mean, you know, my dad,~ uh,~ you know, just basically made us work, you know, and that's, and, and don't get me wrong.
He was, he's a successful farmer,~ uh,~ but he wasn't very [00:30:00] transparent, you know, he didn't give me a roadmap when I went to college, they just basically said, Hey. It's over there and I went to college, you know,~ uh,~ to, to give the roadmap of how I got here. Doesn't even make sense because I went to school and got an ag degree.
~Uh, ~and so for me to try to be, I just got to be very transparent and communicate everything I possibly can to my children. ~Uh, ~ I got to get away from, don't just say because I told you so. You know, you say that when they're little kids and you spank their butt, but I got a 15 year old, you know, I have to give him a lot of explanation and kind of talk him through things and he.
A lot of times he don't get the answer he wants to hear, but,~ uh,~ I have to, I have to just really, really, really be transparent and give a lot of explanation and try to just make every, every chance I get, make it a teaching
Chaz Wolfe: moment. Yeah, exactly. I mean, you're his mentor, right? Like who, if, if you're [00:31:00] not going to mentor him as a young man, who will?
~Um, ~you know, I didn't, I didn't have that growing up as a, as a young man. And so I can only imagine. And where I would be today, if I had someone mentoring me at 15 years old, helping me understand situations in life. And I think that that's one of the greatest gifts that we can give our children, not just the money piece, but yeah, just situations in life.
But yeah, that's how, that's how you think about money too. ~Um, ~what, what do you think was a good decision that you've made in your business journey? That's just really practical. Something that you would do over and over again, that the listeners can maybe go apply in their business.
Mark White: I don't know, that's a hard, hard, hard question because I, I do so many different things on a daily basis,~ uh,~ because I wear so many hats, you know, you know, we've talked about my construction company, but,~ uh,~ I've been kind of the managing partner of Palm Development for the last seven years and,~ um, uh, ~so it's really, really hard to, hard to say, but,~ uh,~ yeah.[00:32:00]
You know, basically just being calculated on everything you do. ~Uh, ~you know, if it don't, dollars got to make sense, you know, everything you do has got to make sense. And so,~ um,~ never bite off more than you can chew from a, from a job standpoint. ~Um, ~early in our career. Randall and I was killing it on everything we were doing.
And we had an opportunity, some really, really large jobs were coming to our town and,~ uh,~ we had one of our masonry subcontractors come to us and say, Hey, we want to bid on this, but we don't have a masonry license. Well, it's easy for us to go add the masonry license to our general contractor's license.
So we negotiated with these guys to,~ um,~ to come to work for us. We made them foremans, put them on these masonry jobs. ~Uh, ~and it was a father son combo, had their own business. We put one over one job, one over another. And we got about 2, 000, 000 worth of masonry on the books overnight and we were a million [00:33:00] dollar a year company when we did this by the way.
Right. And,~ uh,~ six weeks in they both said this ain't for us and walked off. Smooth! Yeah, so we were like, what the heck, you know? So, we were very fortunate. We came out of that process and ~uh, ~we only lost about, Three quarters of a million dollars over that. But,~ uh,~ luckily that would, that would have sank most companies.
Luckily we had, I had a very good year. ~Uh, ~building,~ uh,~ medical clinics that I hadn't gotten to start with. So my partner and I basically worked for about a year for free. And it was the most expensive schooling we ever had in our life. And,~ uh,~ once we got through that, that was, you know, that was one of those, don't ever do that again.
But it was also a blessing in disguise because we ended up keeping that masonry division, hired the right people. And we still do masonry today. And it's. A [00:34:00] very profitable endeavor. So it was one of the worst decisions I ever made that turned into a long-term play. So, you know, that's kind of what those just keep grinding and, you know, hopefully it'll work out.
I'm not gonna say if you grind, it's always gonna work out because it don't, but luckily
Chaz Wolfe: we made that happen. So, yeah, it's interesting how you tell the story because,~ uh,~ you're right. Just because you grind doesn't mean it works out. However,~ um,~ You know, an optimist, which clearly I can tell that you are,~ um,~ I, I recognize a fellow optimist when I, when I see one, but you know,~ um,~ an optimist thinks, well, this is, it doesn't matter how the turnout is.
It's going to be for my good. ~Um, ~I'll either learn a really expensive lesson to your point or, or I,~ uh,~ or I won,~ uh,~ from,~ uh,~ from how I thought it was going to go either way. I actually win still,~ um,~ one just may. Set me back a little bit in time, money, or effort. ~Um, ~and so, you know, like you said, luckily for you guys, we're able to kind of re reconfigure things.
What do you think, you know, like looking back on that, like, I mean, [00:35:00] in the moment you were like, oh my gosh, you know, quarter of a million dollars or three quarters of a million dollars just gone working for free. Like that doesn't feel good at all, but. Now looking in many years later at one of your profitable, you know, divisions, that's a big deal.
Like, and somewhere along the line there, you had to kind of go, let's just do it anyway. Or was it more of a like, crap, we got this set up, we have to do it and so let's just keep it moving. I don't know. What, what
Mark White: was it? Well, we just, you know, it was one spec. It was, well it was both of those jobs that we got, one of 'em was a jail.
And if anybody on here. And you're in the masonry business, and somebody calls you about doing a jail, just hang up the phone, just walk away. They're not profitable, I don't care how you try. So,~ uh,~ but,~ uh,~ I mean, we were just neck deep in it, and, and we had contracts, and these things were bonded, and, luckily we were diversified.
But as far as just completing those jobs.
Once we got [00:36:00] through them, you know, a lot of people were thrown in the towel, but once we got through them and we kind of had created and built somewhat of a good productive crew, we just continued with the masonry. And it, and being the general contractor. ~Uh, ~if we weren't in the general contractor already and having our own masonry jobs to go do, we might not have kept that going, but you know, that's one thing about what we do as a general contractor, even in a down economy,~ uh,~ we do, we, we have that subcontractor mindset.
We were landscapers before we become a contractor, right? So you could cut my business in half and I promise I'd still be profitable because I would just figure out how to self perform more of that work. Right. And,~ uh,~ and that's what makes us so aggressive and so competitive in our market is because we control the schedule and we control.
The profits of concrete and [00:37:00] masonry in, in our business.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, absolutely. I love,~ uh,~ you know, the calculation. ~Um, ~you mentioned something a little bit ago about family and that,~ uh,~ early, you probably sacrificed some of that more than you would have liked to admit to. But now you, you flipped the script on that.
My question for you is maybe a little twofold. Maybe you can give us a little bit of then and a little bit now. But I'm a firm believer that you have to be obsessed about family, marriage, you know, the other things as well as the business. And just like you, I spent many, many years building a business, multiple businesses, and I probably sacrificed some of that, even though I was saying that it was important, I wasn't applying myself in those areas.
And I think there's a lot of people that think that it has to be one or the other. And so I've just subscribed to the thought now that. As long as I do whatever it takes, like what you're saying, be obsessed about both areas or even other areas, my health or whatever, that I can do it all. And so my question to you is that back then when it was harder, and maybe now when it's [00:38:00] a little easier, how are you obsessing practically with your family or marriage or children?
Mark White: , I have three children and all three are involved in sports. ~Uh, ~and so. I literally just have to call my wife daily and say, where are we tonight? Where are we tomorrow? So obsessing,~ um, uh, ~the roles flip. So in the early days, it was, it was all about the business. And I just try to be home for supper.
Now it's, it's totally different. So probably six days a week, we have somewhere to be on a schedule, at least one kid and there has been not for, we had three different places to be on the same night,~ uh,~ my daughter plays competitive,~ uh,~ softball, competitive volleyball, my oldest, he's not hardly as much.
He's just playing some baseball. My youngest is eight and he's playing fall football, fall baseball, you [00:39:00] know, just so it's somewhere all the time. And, and so basically I just make sure I'm involved in everything they do. And I mean, I was my daughter's softball coach. I'm just still a couple of months ago and I decided to let that go.
So I can focus more on her as an individual and less as a team. But,~ uh,~ you know, my, but my business got to the point where I can do it in such fraction of a time, you know, I can do it from home, you know, our development company,~ uh,~ a year and a half ago, we hired a lady to be the CEO. So I don't have to worry about signing letters of intent and purchase agreements and reviewing site plans and, and, and I'm actually missing a meeting right now with one of our customers.
She's got it handled. So now I, I manage everything from a 30, 000 foot view. And,~ um,~ and the only thing that I really get digging the weeds with is when we land new customers and I kind of, kind of [00:40:00] cultivate that relationship. So, so that's what I really focused my time on is cultivating those new relationships.
In our business and managing everything from a 30, 000 foot.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah. I appreciate that. ~Uh, ~that kind of like linear,~ um,~ like progression, I guess, All right, mark, you said a few minutes ago, you know, when, when in the early days, you know, you were just trying to get home for supper. Give us just a little picture of that because I know what that feels like.
~Um, ~when it was just all I could do was just to get, get home for supper and be with the kids for a little bit of time before they went down to bed. And then I went right back to the office like you mentioned. And so I'm sure that there's a lot of early business owners listening right now. Thank you.
That are in the same situation and they, they either feel bad about it or maybe they don't, I don't know, maybe their wife's on them,~ uh,~ or maybe their spouse, whatever it looks like. So for you, give us just a little insight, just peel back the layer, just a half second, when you like rushed home for supper, what that look like and what were you doing specifically with the kids to, you know, be intentional with your time or maybe time with your wife?
What'd that look like?[00:41:00]
Mark White: Well, I mean, fortunate for me,~ uh,~ in those days, my, my kids were young, so we weren't, you know, at sporting events and where most folks go work their eight to five job, I was working six to seven, basically I just try to get home every night in time to have supper with the family and, and at least be there to get the kids in the bed.
Midnight spend in my office in my home office after they went to bed,~ uh,~ taking care of the business side of the work. So work all day, spend a few hours with the wife and kids, and then work, work an hour or two before I go to bed. So that was, that was the early days of business. ~Uh, ~and then just fortunate my life and my business lined up.
You know,~ uh,~ as, as my business, as my kids grew, so did my business. So as my time become more free at work, I was required more at home and, you know, things are done. Was, was that planned? No, I was just very blessed and very [00:42:00] lucky for that to happen. ~Uh, ~and probably wouldn't have survived working like that my whole career.
~Uh, ~because if I wasn't any good at it, I probably would have, would have failed and moved on and went and worked for the man, I guess, but,
Chaz Wolfe: ~uh, ~yeah. Yeah, we don't know that there's zero chance that would happen.
Mark White: And that's what, that's what happened with the, that, that opportunity for those masons, they work for themselves and they come to work for me and they wasn't used to answering to somebody.
I get that. Right. You know, it was a mistake on both our part. ~Um, ~but you know, it's, I would never punch a clock ever again in my life.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, it makes sense. ~Uh, ~to your point though. There's some people that,~ uh,~ aren't, aren't made for that. And it doesn't mean that that's any different or better. It just means that the people listening here are like you and I, and that's fine.
We're going to figure it out. It's just going to look a lot different and probably going to have to. Work harder, differently, more committed in a way [00:43:00] for a, probably a longer period of time than we're comfortable with if we're just being honest. ~Um, ~I got one last question here for you, Mark, as we wind this thing up, you've had just, you know, years of experience, multiple industries of experience now and success.
If you had the chance to whisper podcast.
Mark White: And I've yet to come up with an answer, so I'm going to try my best, but,~ uh,~ but if I had to, if I had to just whisper to my younger self, I think I would just say, stay motivated, stay, stay engaged in the business and don't give up. ~Uh, ~because there's been plenty of times along the way that,~ um, uh, ~I wanted to give up, but I think two would be,~ uh,~ be more calculated.
You know, even though I've been very successful,~ uh,~ there's like that time with taking those projects. Since then, [00:44:00] I've had opportunities to take really big jobs and we bowed out. You know, here I am doing 5, 10, 15 million dollar jobs and we had an opportunity at a 40 million dollar job and they wanted us to bid on it and we were like in the ninth hour like.
We're not ready for that. When a lot of people would have took that opportunity if they could have gotten it.
Chaz Wolfe: Yeah, no, I totally understand where you're coming from. You know, when you're saying that,~ uh,~ you have an opportunity at a big project and it's difficult, right? It's difficult to say no, especially when. You get a little excited. I mean, you're a winner. Like you said, I don't, I don't,~ uh,~ you know, I'm committed.
I'm not done. And so why do you think ultimately you did turn that 40 million project down?
Mark White: Just because I knew,~ uh,~ just, I knew I didn't have the staff to give them a good product. You know, I was going to have to grow my staff too fast. I mean, growth. I mean, we went through the ridiculous growth in our, our [00:45:00] business sale.
I think we did 1. 4 million our first year in 2010. We've been to 2. 8 the next year. You know,~ uh,~ the first four years we was in business, we grew by a hundred percent. Yeah. Which in that realm of 1 million to 10 million, it's not a big deal. It really isn't. But when you get to that 20, 30 million dollar.
And we've even approached the 40 million mark. all right, we're at a different level now. And so we're at the level we want to stay. ~Uh, ~one of our senior project managers hit us up. Like, I thought y'all wanted to grow. And I'm like, no, we're good. I mean, there comes a point when you got to.
You got to make good with what you got. ~Uh, ~you got to understand the sizes of the business and where the profitability is because there's growth phases where you're literally going backwards if you're not careful.[00:46:00]
Well, I've got a couple of websites. So,~ uh,~ our, our construction company is bargerconstructioncompany. com. And then my development company is PalmDevelopmentPartners. com. And of course you can find me on LinkedIn or Facebook, but our construction company, we,~ uh,~ locally we specialize in, you know, anything,~ uh,~ what we call blueprint projects.
You know, where the architects are managing the projects. We're doing colleges. Churches, high schools, I'm fixed to start, fixed to start the high school football stadium for,~ uh,~ the local high school. And then I'll, and in multiple states we do single tenant buildings, so I do urgent care clinics, autism clinics,~ uh,~ mental health facilities.
But we,~ uh,~ as a development company, we go into markets, we,~ uh, uh, ~acquire the land, we,~ uh,~ negotiate the lease with the client and then we build them their site specific building. So I've done probably 125 [00:47:00] projects like that over nine States in the last eight years or so. And,~ um,~ so if you, if you're a business that need a real estate partner, we're, we, we can, we can be that evidence.
~Um, ~been very fortunate to have some great partners in all aspects of, you know, good Christian,~ uh,~ like minded people that, that I'm in business with,
Thank you.
[00:48:00] [00:49:00]

Host Chaz Wolfe sits down with Mark White, the man behind Barger Construction’s massive success. From being unsatisfied with just good enough to teaching us the true power of saying no, Mark unravels the principles that guide his business philosophy. Tune in to hear Mark’s nuanced take on building generational wealth while steering clear of fostering entitlement in the next generation. Major Topics Discussed: Doing Whatever it Takes: Mark shares his journey of relentless pursuit in the construction industry, and the mindset that helped Barger Construction grow exponentially over the years. Never Satisfied: We delve deep into the philosophy of never settling and always aiming for more - a principle that Mark stands by in his business operations. Building Generational Wealth Without Creating Entitled Children: Mark White discusses the fine line between providing for the future generations and nurturing a sense of entitlement, offering insights into how he is navigating this complex landscape. Being So Successful Sometimes You Have to Say NO: Mark shares instances from his career where saying no was the best decision for the stability and focus of his current business. The Power of No: We explore the empowering aspect of saying no and how it can pave the path for focused and sustained success.

Mark White:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-white-40588575/

Website: https://www.bargerconstructioncompany.com/

Website: palmdevelopmentpartners.com

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/markwhitebcc

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